Comments on: Is this Heaven or is this Hell? http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/ My Reflections on Faith and Life Fri, 30 Oct 2009 04:30:33 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: Terri http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-167 Terri Tue, 25 Sep 2007 16:39:28 +0000 http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-167 I have seen many people in their own personal hell, twisted and deformed bodies, third world poverty, severe mental and physical illness, torn apart families, financial difficulties to name a few. Some have been self made and some have not. Your right, giving them the knowledge of something better, something safer, something happier, a real sense of Hope in the promise of heaven in the furture with Christ is a glorious thing to ponder. Even better yet, a personal relationship with the one who can help them now in their time of struggle is the only relief that they may ever know here and now in their own personal hells. I have seen many people in their own personal hell, twisted and deformed bodies, third world poverty, severe mental and physical illness, torn apart families, financial difficulties to name a few. Some have been self made and some have not. Your right, giving them the knowledge of something better, something safer, something happier, a real sense of Hope in the promise of heaven in the furture with Christ is a glorious thing to ponder. Even better yet, a personal relationship with the one who can help them now in their time of struggle is the only relief that they may ever know here and now in their own personal hells.

]]> By: Chrissi Morris http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-166 Chrissi Morris Mon, 24 Sep 2007 14:07:04 +0000 http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-166 You always get right to the point. Jesus even taught us to pray..."thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven.." Praying that his kingdom come here is a much different message than moral direction for glory sake. Good thoughts! You always get right to the point. Jesus even taught us to pray…”thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven..”
Praying that his kingdom come here is a much different message than moral direction for glory sake. Good thoughts!

]]> By: astudent http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-165 astudent Sat, 22 Sep 2007 14:28:04 +0000 http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-165 Ethan, The message about Hell comes from the Bible. The Bible is completely true, so the message about Hell is true. Why would anyone need a Savior if there is nothing to be saved from? The good news is although we all deserve Hell, Jesus, who had no sin of His own, allowed Himself to be nailed to a cross and died for anyone who will accept Him, so we do not have to go to Hell. A church that doesn’t preach hell in effect nullifies the sacrifice Jesus made. Again ask yourself who needs a Savior if there is nothing to be saved from. We are not supposed to please the world at the cost of changing the message of the Bible. It is easier to recruit members to a church that doesn’t preach Hell, but that kind of church is nothing more than a community gathering place. As far as judging those out side of the church, the judge is the one that passes sentence and we should not condemn anyone, but we should discern and if they are in danger we show no love by not telling them. You say, “I think this whole heaven and hell thing would be better understood in the answering of this question: “Is this life more like heaven or more like hell?” The Bible says, “(Rev 21:4 NIV) He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away." This is not heaven. Ethan,
The message about Hell comes from the Bible. The Bible is completely true, so the message about Hell is true.
Why would anyone need a Savior if there is nothing to be saved from? The good news is although we all deserve Hell, Jesus, who had no sin of His own, allowed Himself to be nailed to a cross and died for anyone who will accept Him, so we do not have to go to Hell.
A church that doesn’t preach hell in effect nullifies the sacrifice Jesus made. Again ask yourself who needs a Savior if there is nothing to be saved from.
We are not supposed to please the world at the cost of changing the message of the Bible. It is easier to recruit members to a church that doesn’t preach Hell, but that kind of church is nothing more than a community gathering place.
As far as judging those out side of the church, the judge is the one that passes sentence and we should not condemn anyone, but we should discern and if they are in danger we show no love by not telling them.
You say, “I think this whole heaven and hell thing would be better understood in the answering of this question: “Is this life more like heaven or more like hell?”
The Bible says, “(Rev 21:4 NIV) He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”
This is not heaven.

]]> By: The Great Dance http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-164 The Great Dance Sat, 22 Sep 2007 11:36:36 +0000 http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-164 Wow! I was beginning to think I was the only one on WordPress who felt that way. I've often mused with friends (Christian and non-Christian), "How is the message Good News when the typical Christian starts with, 'You're going to hell; but...'" Is it me or do you think most people have turned off at that point. You are absolutely correct, what Jesus gave us is GOOD news. God so loves us that he sent His only Son to provide the reconciliation He has always wanted; to give us a connection to Him that was ALWAYS His plan. Thanks for the jolt of hope. YBIC, Frank Ancona thegreatdance.wordpress.com Wow! I was beginning to think I was the only one on WordPress who felt that way.

I’ve often mused with friends (Christian and non-Christian), “How is the message Good News when the typical Christian starts with, ‘You’re going to hell; but…’” Is it me or do you think most people have turned off at that point.

You are absolutely correct, what Jesus gave us is GOOD news. God so loves us that he sent His only Son to provide the reconciliation He has always wanted; to give us a connection to Him that was ALWAYS His plan.

Thanks for the jolt of hope.

YBIC,
Frank Ancona
thegreatdance.wordpress.com

]]> By: dovelove http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-163 dovelove Sat, 22 Sep 2007 11:32:37 +0000 http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-163 Earth is symbolic of the human body, "heaven" and "hell" is in the mind and the heart...and it always has been. The teachings of religion, ironically, create "hell" (fear creates all suffering/hell). The venom of these teachings reach out even beyond the followers of such vile messages ("burning in hell") creating so much "hell" in our world. It creates self-loathing ("sinner") and consequent hating/judging of others. It's an absurdity to think that a human being could believe that he is going to "heaven"-- while at the same time not believing/judging that others will "perish." You may deny it, but there is no way you don't consider that you are above others in this. You can't believe one thing, without believing the other (that others will burn in hell, but you won't.) I can't fathom anything more hellish (this continual fear of others not measuring up -- as well as oneself). That's "hell," babe, no matter how much you try to convince others that you're reeling with joy (simply because you "agree" with this saviour stuff? -- have you really thought about that? -- that this is all it takes to not fry? -- what kind of '"god" wants you to simply think this way so much, that he'll fry ya' if ya' don't? ... ). If indeed one feels joy (knowing others will fry), they'd have no conscious -- and that's what it takes to go to heaven, eh? What a, um, joy it will be to be there. The Bible is a book prolific with symbolic messages. Heaven = peace, hell = suffering ... "Fear not." A directive to prevent "hell," suffering in one's life. (fear creates "hell") Again, an irony given the major amount of fear that religion has poisoned our world with. "Imagine no religion." :) Peace, Dove Earth is symbolic of the human body, “heaven” and “hell” is in the mind and the heart…and it always has been. The teachings of religion, ironically, create “hell” (fear creates all suffering/hell). The venom of these teachings reach out even beyond the followers of such vile messages (“burning in hell”) creating so much “hell” in our world. It creates self-loathing (“sinner”) and consequent hating/judging of others.

It’s an absurdity to think that a human being could believe that he is going to “heaven”– while at the same time not believing/judging that others will “perish.” You may deny it, but there is no way you don’t consider that you are above others in this. You can’t believe one thing, without believing the other (that others will burn in hell, but you won’t.) I can’t fathom anything more hellish (this continual fear of others not measuring up — as well as oneself). That’s “hell,” babe, no matter how much you try to convince others that you’re reeling with joy (simply because you “agree” with this saviour stuff? — have you really thought about that? — that this is all it takes to not fry? — what kind of ‘”god” wants you to simply think this way so much, that he’ll fry ya’ if ya’ don’t? … ).

If indeed one feels joy (knowing others will fry), they’d have no conscious — and that’s what it takes to go to heaven, eh? What a, um, joy it will be to be there.

The Bible is a book prolific with symbolic messages.
Heaven = peace, hell = suffering … “Fear not.” A directive to prevent “hell,” suffering in one’s life. (fear creates “hell”) Again, an irony given the major amount of fear that religion has poisoned our world with.

“Imagine no religion.” :)

Peace,
Dove

]]> By: quantumfoam http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-162 quantumfoam Fri, 21 Sep 2007 17:28:44 +0000 http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-162 it might possible that there is no one left that is purest of us and this makes no use of saying that heaven is coming to earth. actually i want to say that hell or heaven are same the only difference is our prespective.Some thing heaven for some person is may be hell for other's. your deeds can make any place hell or heaven. it might possible that there is no one left that is purest of us and this makes no use of saying that heaven is coming to earth.
actually i want to say that hell or heaven are same the only difference is our prespective.Some thing heaven for some person is may be hell for other’s. your deeds can make any place hell or heaven.

]]> By: Steve http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-161 Steve Fri, 21 Sep 2007 16:25:53 +0000 http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-161 <i>If you look at Paul’s message in Acts 17 you will see that he mentions nothing of hell to the pagan philosophers of the day. This message instead brings the good news of God’s unveiling of himself to the Greek people of the day. It was a message that revealed a God that could be known and walked with through life. A God who allow sinful man to have relationship with him despite their out and out rebellion towards him. </i> Ethan, I think you nailed it. There are too many references to hell and 'eternal judgment' to discount the idea, but too often our focus with unbelievers is misplaced. Our Great Commission is not to spread gloom and doom about a fiery hell to come, but rather, the good news of the atonement of Christ and the relationship with Him that it entails. Paul was speaking to those who had at least some degree of intellectual curiosity about Christianity and he handled it well. We tend to come in with guns ablazin' and smite people over the head with Scriptures and proclamations that don't get to the heartfelt need in the bosom of the unbeliever. If you look at Paul’s message in Acts 17 you will see that he mentions nothing of hell to the pagan philosophers of the day. This message instead brings the good news of God’s unveiling of himself to the Greek people of the day. It was a message that revealed a God that could be known and walked with through life. A God who allow sinful man to have relationship with him despite their out and out rebellion towards him.

Ethan,
I think you nailed it. There are too many references to hell and ‘eternal judgment’ to discount the idea, but too often our focus with unbelievers is misplaced. Our Great Commission is not to spread gloom and doom about a fiery hell to come, but rather, the good news of the atonement of Christ and the relationship with Him that it entails.

Paul was speaking to those who had at least some degree of intellectual curiosity about Christianity and he handled it well. We tend to come in with guns ablazin’ and smite people over the head with Scriptures and proclamations that don’t get to the heartfelt need in the bosom of the unbeliever.

]]> By: Jerome M http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-160 Jerome M Fri, 21 Sep 2007 15:47:34 +0000 http://ethanmorris.wordpress.com/2007/09/21/is-this-heaven-or-is-this-hell/#comment-160 Ethan, Great post. Two passages struck me: “What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church?” (1 Cor 5:12)" "What would happen if Christians began to express a message that heaven was coming to earth and that anyone from the most seedy to the purest of us could freely enter?" It's refreshing to come across a Christian who sees the importance of spreading the religion's message without using the "fire and brimstone" tactics so often employed by fundamentalists. Compassion will certainly draw more to your ranks than judgment. Ethan,

Great post.

Two passages struck me:

“What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church?” (1 Cor 5:12)”

“What would happen if Christians began to express a message that heaven was coming to earth and that anyone from the most seedy to the purest of us could freely enter?”

It’s refreshing to come across a Christian who sees the importance of spreading the religion’s message without using the “fire and brimstone” tactics so often employed by fundamentalists. Compassion will certainly draw more to your ranks than judgment.

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